Back when I was young, I had a job building, and installing, custom stereos for cars. The place I worked at also did a lot of modifications, one of the most popular things we did was lift trucks, add huge wheels, move exhaust to end above the backs of the cabs, etc. People who had trucks like that, just like the people with the stereos you could hear 5 miles away, absolutely did concern themselves with the way they were perceived, having that tricked out truck. They also rarely used them for work, or took them off road. They liked to cruise them down the night life areas, and show off. They would talk about how excited they were to do this. This was the same with people who tricked their cars out like something from TFATF movies. They never raced, they just showed off.
A lot of that is for the same reason people dress nice or have nice accessories like watches and handbags: Conspicuous consumption makes it look like you have money to at least some people.
And anywhere there are vehicles there’s going to be a vehicle culture, from low riders to pickups to rice tractors
correct, and fast fashion, precious metals, and gems, etc for this are bad. it is a lot harder to deal with the fast fashion thing, because it took over the industry needed for clothing. but yeah, I feel the same about doing things like buying jewelry without concern for where it came from, as jewelry is something that can be easily boycotted. The big difference is, someone wearing a ring with a big old blood diamond on it will never inject its way into my life, and what I am doing, like getting stuck in traffic with some big coal-rolling d-bag, or someone whose muffler is replaced, or their stereo is as loud as a stadium concert, and so on.
I mean, you can make cars cool without making them obnoxious, inefficient, intrusive, poorly fit for local infrastructure, etc.
Unless you think things that cause greater issues for other people are the only ways in which cars can be cool. Then I don’t know what to tell you, at that point it is a personal problem.
I love my $30k Miata. 2339 lbs, 35 mpg, its fast enough, handles better than enough, can go for 200k+ miles, I’ve driven faster and more expensive cars, but that one is by far the most fun. Yes, cars can definitely be cool without having 13 mpg, and annoying other people, without blocking the vision of others to operate safely. The only issue is that it forces you to drive aggressively to avoid these giant fucking emotional support trucks killing you cause they can’t see you.
Most of what are generally considered coolest cars are loud, inefficient, and hard to maneuver around a city. Think Lambos, Ferraris, Bentleys, low riders, hot rods, in addition to lifted trucks and fart-can Hondas.
It doesn’t have to be that way though. A lot of that desire was created by car companies using massive advertisement campaigns over decades, to convince people the cars with the most profit margin, and dependency on the system, are cool. All the reasons beneath the obnoxious parts, that ultimately are what people like, can be done differently now. You don’t need a loud car, with shitty normal road compatibility, to have a fast, agile, car, that could be targeted at the consumer. You don’t need loud, smog belching, monster trucks, that fit nowhere, to be able to do all the off road shit. The rest are aesthetic desires, which are easy to manipulate, through advertising, over time.
The whole car industry could just start an unrelenting ad campaign on the side of those who do not like coal rollers, and paint those using them as bad people, and, since a huge amount of the population hate them already, it wouldn’t be all that long before they are a thing of the past.
As someone who loves and talks up her subcompact, a lot of people won’t ever see it as cool. In part because it’s so practical in an unobtrusive way. It’s cool like getting regular cardio or eating a diet high in vegetables: once it’s a part of your life consistently it’s awesome, but it’s not showy, decadent, or immediately fun (ok actually it is if you like a zippy vehicle). At least where I live a lot of people see trucks as both a part of their cultural identity and as associated with things they enjoy like hunting and hauling.
Making the smallest practical vehicle cool will be difficult. I think bicycles are actually one of the easier for it because it’s the only practical form of transportation that actively makes you more attractive. But it’ll generally need to involve more appeals to fun and coolness than being a nag or appealing to practicality.
I am not saying we need to make subcompacts cool, or the smallest possible vehicle, just ones that aren’t actively intrusive to the lives of everyone stuck around them, dangerous on busy roads, and hard to fit through neighborhood streets, that are wildly sucking gas down, while spewing pollution out.
I agree that advertising did that for trucks, but race cars are loud and fast and terrible on the road and people will still think they’re cool because they’re loud and fast and agile. The loudness is because muffling the exhaust reduces horsepower, the lack of ground clearance is for handling. These are physics problems and people who want to go fast with internal combustion will always trend that way.
Plus if Lamborghini or Ferrari or Porsche could sell a fancy car without some insanely complex engine and suspension for the same amount of money they’d absolutely do it. Often those cars are built because there are rules in motorsport that require a certain number of production cars that often end up costing the company money.
And there will always be people who modify their cars for whatever reason. No car company in the world makes a car with an adjustable suspension that can make the car so low it scrapes the road, but people do it anyway.
But, like I said, car companies are doing a great job of making cars uncool by just making them electric, and then spitting out crossover after crossover after crossover that aren’t just ugly, but are also uninspiring. Cars are turning into appliances like microwaves and dishwashers, which are very much not cool.
Yes, I get that loud attracts some people, especially people who want to force it on other people. They were why I was installing those stereo systems, in their car, and not in their house. As for things like the ground clearance, if you are going to spend like 6 digits on a car, of 10s of thousands on mods, there are things like clearance adjust suspensions, for road, terrain, track, shifting. The people who actually go as far as to make low riders, and other things where they have to do a lot of their own work, are so rare, its not really a concern compared to modded coups, lifted trucks, and fart boxes.
They put a great big resonator in the exhaust of a four cylinder car, generally a Honda Civic. They think it makes them sound cool but it really doesn’t.
Sometimes they’ll even remove the catalytic convertor for extra fart sound.
At least performance mods can improve efficiency, with the focus of getting more power from the motor to the pavement. If they are actual performance mods (as opposed to just making exhaust louder or adding a rear spoiler on a front wheel drive car), with exceptions of ones that do that by increasing fuel use.
Though even with that one, driving style can matter. Anecdotal, but my car has a sports mode and an eco mode, as well as a fuel use indicator. I found that using sports mode and then having a range of speed I’d drive at (accelerate hard to top speed of the range, then reduce power so that it slows to the low end then accelerating again) was the most efficient way to drive it. If I tried the same in eco mode, the reduced power meant I spent more time doing the acceleration, and either of those was more fuel efficient than just maintaining one speed. Though it was a frustrating way to drive (both for me and I’m sure for anyone who ended up behind me). You couldn’t go on auto pilot doing it that way and had to pay constant attention to your speed.
It’s kinda like the race to idle strategy for CPU/GPU efficiency. Use lots of power when it’s needed so that it can go back to using much less power.
Yeah, I don’t mind mods that make things better for daily use. I also don’t mind big performance mods, or truck get bigger mods. There is a caveat though, please put the mods to use. If you spend 10k turning your car into a racing/performance car, and you take it to the track, good for you for having a hobby, and skill. Need a big fucking truck to hall around your construction site worth of tools, and materials? Awesome, you have what you need. Modify it for off road use? If you go off road, even just for fun, sure, fine. If you need it because you work in remote locations, or something, wonderful, you have what you need.
Having these loud, intrusive, difficult, gas hog, emission machines, and all you do is daily drive it, and show off? Well, I will look down on that behavior.
Can we say the same about motorcycles? I feel like leftists give a pass to motorcycles because of efficiency, but they’re always the loudest vehicles on the road, one fucking boomer around me loves cruising the neighborhood blaring his ambiguously gay 80s hairband music louder than I can even get either of my vehicles.
I absolutely feel that way about motorcycles. You love your motorcycle? Hell yeah, but if you’re driving past and I have to stop talking because you’re drowning my conversation out I think you’re an asshole. Honestly, I don’t even get why people think super loud motorcycles are cool. Motorcycles definitely can be cool, but obnoxiousness removes all coolness
Hell, I’m generally sympathetic to loudness, I’m hard of hearing and can struggle with volume control and need things louder than some people like, but there’s a line.
Yeah, the line is causing hearing loss apparently lol. But yeah there’s no way those guys don’t have hearing loss on those things. And I swear to God, if I ever catch someone wearing earplugs on a loud motorcycle? Hoooo boy! Someone’s gonna wish they WERE back in 'nam!
A spoiler on a fwd car is not always for downforce. Yeah a giant wing on a fwd car puts more weight (both from the weight of the spoiler, and from the down force acted on it) on the back, and less on the front, reducing grip. However a lot of spoilers just make the car a little more slippery through the air, giving a passive, mild efficiency bonus.
![[meme] reason for bike commuting](https://sopuli.xyz/pictrs/image/ea0cd0b4-1ef1-49cf-b917-320da29efb55.webp){kind=link}
Back when I was young, I had a job building, and installing, custom stereos for cars. The place I worked at also did a lot of modifications, one of the most popular things we did was lift trucks, add huge wheels, move exhaust to end above the backs of the cabs, etc. People who had trucks like that, just like the people with the stereos you could hear 5 miles away, absolutely did concern themselves with the way they were perceived, having that tricked out truck. They also rarely used them for work, or took them off road. They liked to cruise them down the night life areas, and show off. They would talk about how excited they were to do this. This was the same with people who tricked their cars out like something from TFATF movies. They never raced, they just showed off.
A lot of that is for the same reason people dress nice or have nice accessories like watches and handbags: Conspicuous consumption makes it look like you have money to at least some people.
And anywhere there are vehicles there’s going to be a vehicle culture, from low riders to pickups to rice tractors
correct, and fast fashion, precious metals, and gems, etc for this are bad. it is a lot harder to deal with the fast fashion thing, because it took over the industry needed for clothing. but yeah, I feel the same about doing things like buying jewelry without concern for where it came from, as jewelry is something that can be easily boycotted. The big difference is, someone wearing a ring with a big old blood diamond on it will never inject its way into my life, and what I am doing, like getting stuck in traffic with some big coal-rolling d-bag, or someone whose muffler is replaced, or their stereo is as loud as a stadium concert, and so on.
I think the best solution to this is to just make cars not cool anymore, and EVs are doing a great job at that.
I mean, you can make cars cool without making them obnoxious, inefficient, intrusive, poorly fit for local infrastructure, etc.
Unless you think things that cause greater issues for other people are the only ways in which cars can be cool. Then I don’t know what to tell you, at that point it is a personal problem.
I love my $30k Miata. 2339 lbs, 35 mpg, its fast enough, handles better than enough, can go for 200k+ miles, I’ve driven faster and more expensive cars, but that one is by far the most fun. Yes, cars can definitely be cool without having 13 mpg, and annoying other people, without blocking the vision of others to operate safely. The only issue is that it forces you to drive aggressively to avoid these giant fucking emotional support trucks killing you cause they can’t see you.
Yes, I am glad to hear that the feds are at least looking at new regulations on truck/suv design due to the increase in pedestrian death.
Most of what are generally considered coolest cars are loud, inefficient, and hard to maneuver around a city. Think Lambos, Ferraris, Bentleys, low riders, hot rods, in addition to lifted trucks and fart-can Hondas.
It doesn’t have to be that way though. A lot of that desire was created by car companies using massive advertisement campaigns over decades, to convince people the cars with the most profit margin, and dependency on the system, are cool. All the reasons beneath the obnoxious parts, that ultimately are what people like, can be done differently now. You don’t need a loud car, with shitty normal road compatibility, to have a fast, agile, car, that could be targeted at the consumer. You don’t need loud, smog belching, monster trucks, that fit nowhere, to be able to do all the off road shit. The rest are aesthetic desires, which are easy to manipulate, through advertising, over time.
The whole car industry could just start an unrelenting ad campaign on the side of those who do not like coal rollers, and paint those using them as bad people, and, since a huge amount of the population hate them already, it wouldn’t be all that long before they are a thing of the past.
As someone who loves and talks up her subcompact, a lot of people won’t ever see it as cool. In part because it’s so practical in an unobtrusive way. It’s cool like getting regular cardio or eating a diet high in vegetables: once it’s a part of your life consistently it’s awesome, but it’s not showy, decadent, or immediately fun (ok actually it is if you like a zippy vehicle). At least where I live a lot of people see trucks as both a part of their cultural identity and as associated with things they enjoy like hunting and hauling.
Making the smallest practical vehicle cool will be difficult. I think bicycles are actually one of the easier for it because it’s the only practical form of transportation that actively makes you more attractive. But it’ll generally need to involve more appeals to fun and coolness than being a nag or appealing to practicality.
I am not saying we need to make subcompacts cool, or the smallest possible vehicle, just ones that aren’t actively intrusive to the lives of everyone stuck around them, dangerous on busy roads, and hard to fit through neighborhood streets, that are wildly sucking gas down, while spewing pollution out.
I agree that advertising did that for trucks, but race cars are loud and fast and terrible on the road and people will still think they’re cool because they’re loud and fast and agile. The loudness is because muffling the exhaust reduces horsepower, the lack of ground clearance is for handling. These are physics problems and people who want to go fast with internal combustion will always trend that way.
Plus if Lamborghini or Ferrari or Porsche could sell a fancy car without some insanely complex engine and suspension for the same amount of money they’d absolutely do it. Often those cars are built because there are rules in motorsport that require a certain number of production cars that often end up costing the company money.
And there will always be people who modify their cars for whatever reason. No car company in the world makes a car with an adjustable suspension that can make the car so low it scrapes the road, but people do it anyway.
But, like I said, car companies are doing a great job of making cars uncool by just making them electric, and then spitting out crossover after crossover after crossover that aren’t just ugly, but are also uninspiring. Cars are turning into appliances like microwaves and dishwashers, which are very much not cool.
Yes, I get that loud attracts some people, especially people who want to force it on other people. They were why I was installing those stereo systems, in their car, and not in their house. As for things like the ground clearance, if you are going to spend like 6 digits on a car, of 10s of thousands on mods, there are things like clearance adjust suspensions, for road, terrain, track, shifting. The people who actually go as far as to make low riders, and other things where they have to do a lot of their own work, are so rare, its not really a concern compared to modded coups, lifted trucks, and fart boxes.
What’s a fart can Honda?
They put a great big resonator in the exhaust of a four cylinder car, generally a Honda Civic. They think it makes them sound cool but it really doesn’t.
Sometimes they’ll even remove the catalytic convertor for extra fart sound.
At least performance mods can improve efficiency, with the focus of getting more power from the motor to the pavement. If they are actual performance mods (as opposed to just making exhaust louder or adding a rear spoiler on a front wheel drive car), with exceptions of ones that do that by increasing fuel use.
Though even with that one, driving style can matter. Anecdotal, but my car has a sports mode and an eco mode, as well as a fuel use indicator. I found that using sports mode and then having a range of speed I’d drive at (accelerate hard to top speed of the range, then reduce power so that it slows to the low end then accelerating again) was the most efficient way to drive it. If I tried the same in eco mode, the reduced power meant I spent more time doing the acceleration, and either of those was more fuel efficient than just maintaining one speed. Though it was a frustrating way to drive (both for me and I’m sure for anyone who ended up behind me). You couldn’t go on auto pilot doing it that way and had to pay constant attention to your speed.
It’s kinda like the race to idle strategy for CPU/GPU efficiency. Use lots of power when it’s needed so that it can go back to using much less power.
Yeah, I don’t mind mods that make things better for daily use. I also don’t mind big performance mods, or truck get bigger mods. There is a caveat though, please put the mods to use. If you spend 10k turning your car into a racing/performance car, and you take it to the track, good for you for having a hobby, and skill. Need a big fucking truck to hall around your construction site worth of tools, and materials? Awesome, you have what you need. Modify it for off road use? If you go off road, even just for fun, sure, fine. If you need it because you work in remote locations, or something, wonderful, you have what you need.
Having these loud, intrusive, difficult, gas hog, emission machines, and all you do is daily drive it, and show off? Well, I will look down on that behavior.
Can we say the same about motorcycles? I feel like leftists give a pass to motorcycles because of efficiency, but they’re always the loudest vehicles on the road, one fucking boomer around me loves cruising the neighborhood blaring his ambiguously gay 80s hairband music louder than I can even get either of my vehicles.
I absolutely feel that way about motorcycles. You love your motorcycle? Hell yeah, but if you’re driving past and I have to stop talking because you’re drowning my conversation out I think you’re an asshole. Honestly, I don’t even get why people think super loud motorcycles are cool. Motorcycles definitely can be cool, but obnoxiousness removes all coolness
Hell, I’m generally sympathetic to loudness, I’m hard of hearing and can struggle with volume control and need things louder than some people like, but there’s a line.
Yeah, the line is causing hearing loss apparently lol. But yeah there’s no way those guys don’t have hearing loss on those things. And I swear to God, if I ever catch someone wearing earplugs on a loud motorcycle? Hoooo boy! Someone’s gonna wish they WERE back in 'nam!
Yeah, and, while they use less gas, they release more particle pollutants into the air.
A spoiler on a fwd car is not always for downforce. Yeah a giant wing on a fwd car puts more weight (both from the weight of the spoiler, and from the down force acted on it) on the back, and less on the front, reducing grip. However a lot of spoilers just make the car a little more slippery through the air, giving a passive, mild efficiency bonus.