How the heck is that US propaganda? It’s historical fact
Um, aktually, the Ukronazis started the war in 1991 when they ILLEGALLY declared ‘independence’ from the glorious USSR with a paltry 93% in approval of the plebiscite.
Alternatives or addendums:
- Crimea was actually invaded by polite green men with no Russian affiliation and the resulting election was completely free and fair
- Russia was just Defending Ethnic Minorities in the Donbass!
- NATO provocation mind-controlled Putin into invading
- Everything started in 2022 and Russian troops were AGGRESSIVELY ATTACKED when all they did was kill a few border guards and try to drive an entire army to Kyiv!
Please imagine this meme that I am too lazy to create:
NATO: exists
Is this provocation?
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I believe 4X games tend to label that option “Fabricate a claim”
It doesn’t even matter in this day and age. Claims have no meaning anymore since borders are internationally recognized as they are and only legitimately changed through diplomacy, not through acts of war. In this case, Russia very much, on multiple occasions, acknowledged the borders (including Crimea) and Ukraine’s sovereignty - including their potential wish to join NATO (I don’t remember if it was Lavrov who said it, it was some old interview).
This clears things up. Thank you.
Well played, good sir.
ml bruh
Sometimes facts hurt our feelings and that makes them bad and wrong!
For far right people and tankies facts are propaganda. It’s 1900s all over again.
I ask this again? Why is every single major instance still federated with them?
Literally what the fuck. We have GEOTAGGED IMAGES OF CONFIRMED ACTIVE RUSSIAN SOLDIERS INVADING UKRAINE IN 2014, and it’s called misinfo.
I’m brand new to Lemmy.
I’ve seen multiple comments suggesting that .ml be defederated. It was the first thing I saw when I got here. Sounds like there’s a bad apple and nothing is being done about it
the main reason is because the people who run lemmy.ml are actually the people whi created lemmy.
Also welcome.
!newcommunities@lemmy.world and !newtolemmy@lemmy.ca are useful for new users.
Also if you’re looking for an instance that has ML defederatrd but is still well federated with everything else I recommend lemmy.cafe
It’s the original apple, so it’s historical reasons.
I think it’ll happen though, somebody just needs to bite the bullet and be the first brave one.
Its been kind of an ongoing thing, best to just kind of tune out *ml
I have zero intention of blocking any .ml but, hilariously, I see they’ve deleted one of my comments. I “think” it was because I had the absolute audacity to suggest that there might be one or two bad apples in Hamas. I’ll still pop by their instances though… I’m secure enough to read things I don’t agree with without having a meltdown and trying to erase it from existence. Having said that I do realise why a lot of people would prefer to sidestep the ml area of the fediverse.
I’m gonna guess because the instance is administrated by lemmy main devs and despite them being tankies the quality of discussion is still higher than in other instances. You can compare lemmy.ml local home with lemmy.world
I’ve seen you urging US voters to back third parties despite the mathematical realities of FPTP voting. Of course you prefer discussion on .ml.
I have seen you defending Israel of course you prefer .world
I don’t agree with the atrocity they are committing. Link me to my defense of Israel or (my preference) stop telling lies.
What’s the alternative? Urging them to vote for a fascist or for a genocide supporter?
Lemmy.world home is filled with memes and news from mass media. Lemmy.ml home looks ten times more serious.
What will that accomplish? Tangibly.
Unsupporting the red and blue party will shift the power somewhere else from the same two parties that have been ruling for a century. The only thing preventing someone else from winning is the narrative that a third party can never win. The same narrative continues to be told election after election decade after decade, it’s not so hard to see how it’s been used by the government to never really change administration and cycle in power the red and blue party.
Let’s pretend for a second the largest third parties were viable. That leaves us a brain worm antivaxxer, an anarchocapitalist, and a Russian asset. Are any of those really better?
They aint gonna give you a straight answer assuming they will answer at all, cause they are lying about their reasons either to you and/or themselves. But yeah even including third parties the Dems are generally the best, Democratic Socialists and localised parties not withstanding since they generally caucus with the Dems nationally.
US government is supporting a genocide, ramping up WW3 and entrusting elon musk the military space sector. I think it’s going to take anyone some serious effort to make it worst than that.
I’ve completely blocked them and lemmy is still decent.
I would have thought there would be more concerns with then breaking US/AU or EU laws by there being content explicitly supporting designated terrorist organisations like hezbollah, which is illegal in most of the western world.
I do not support their tankie mindset and ban policies but i don’t really wish lemmy devs to be persecuted by authorities, especially over comments in an internet forum.
I don’t wish for that either, but what I mean is I would have expected mods from other instances to be more weary of the potential legal issues.
WARY
Sorry friend, you were the unlucky perpetrator that I saw today. This is my Long Defeat that I will fight until I die.
TIL. Thanks. Dunno I use weary or wary enough to have ever even thought about it. 😆
Just a simple 3 day invasion. Nothing to see here.
on Nov. 19 we are on the 1000th day of the 3 day invasion
Russia is so glorious and advanced that even their three-day invasions last over 300× longer!
In Russia we invade you (and fail)
the morons brought their dress uniforms to an invasion believing they’d be needed for the PARADES.
goddamn I can’t tell who’s dumber, putin thinking this shit would work, or the idiots that tried it.
I’ve heard that it was just a propaganda quote from a western general and a ten year attrition war is going as planned
Speaking of Ukraine, did you know that currently there are North Korean solders contributing to the invasion. Not only 3 day special military operation is taking 3 years, but also russia, by itself, is unable to complete it.
I believe it was like 15,000 troops
I wonder if they will use the North Korean strategy for saving resources (not feeding its people)
Also Ukraine has F-16s from the Netherlands (Russia shot down a NL plane killing hundreds of civilians)
Boy, they sure are going full Gonzolo Lira over there…
It’d be wonderful if all tankies met the same fate he did.
I’d much much prefer they live to reevaluate their opinions, but I do understand the sentiment.
What side of distorted reality are they going for here? It’s become harder to tell. You’d think anti-Russian, right? Except Republicans are weirdly pro Putin because their orange clown has a hardon for dicktators.
Pro-Russian. .ml is big on bootlicking Putin against ‘Western Imperialism’ and opposing the ‘Ukronazis’.
Basically modern-day Russia still uses Stalinist newspeak, and tankies take it in good faith. In Stalinist newspeak, “imperialism” meant “opposition of the Soviet empire”.
Another thing is, tankies also think the USA is the only obstacle in a global communist revolution, and that social autocracies like Russia and China are not going hinder any attempt at it. China is now also exploiting the global south, and I cannot convince tankies that the Hungaran Fudan university isn’t being gifted for free by the Chinese, but is on a loan that Hungarian taxpayers have to pay back.
Both alt left and alt right repeat russian talking points.
Just totally normal stuff when leftists team up with the furthest right theocratic authoritarians against their true enemy, classic liberals.
@WestBromwich@feddit.uk did you even know you’d been banned due to this comment?
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They’re tankies, they’re pro-Russia, pro-China (to a bootlicking degree) and pro North Korea. Basically anything anti US/west.
They’ve been slurping up Russian propaganda and try and argue that the pro-EU demonstrations in Ukraine in 2014 was some kind of CIA op (because the notion to them that people would willingly choose western ideals is inconceivable) and that Ukraine is full of Nazis and Russia are the good guys defeating Nazis.
I’d strongly avoid blocking the Lemmy.ml instance in your settings. Hexbear and lemmygrad are also similar instances to avoid.
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That’s fair enough. I haven’t blocked hexbear or lemmygrad as it’s kind of entertaining from a morbid sense. But lemmy.ml tries to masquerade as a generic leftist instance but has insane admins and moderators who have absolutely no interest in having other people’s views on their their instance.
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But don’t you know about the azov battalion? This is relevant, please believe me /s
Insane
Tankies gonna tankie
Meanwhile, they’ve poisoned the discourse enough that mods on other instances are over-sensitive to anything that even resembles the sort of stuff they say, and are going overboard in the other direction. For example, I got 24h banned from !politics@lemmy.world a few days ago for calling Democrats right-wing (which is also an easily verifiable fact – nobody disputes that economic liberalism is right-wing, except apparently in that community now).
Edit: some people here are really mad about facts. FYI, you folks are part of the problem. I’ll also note that none of the downvoters have bothered to refute my argument/explain why the mod action against me was justified, so I can only conclude that they know I’m right and are simply butthurt about it for some reason.
Yeah, there’s an element of hypervigilance going on especially now. I hope it’ll die down some after the election. Really need to make people understand the difference between ‘left-wing’ and ‘tankie/tankie apologist shithead’.
In defense of the anons, you probably got the temp ban because that argument is a #1 hit among bad faith trolls coming in to spread their hyperconservstive rhetoric. Unfortunately nuance and the assumption of good faith were among the first casualties of this propaganda war, and it’s damned tragic that thats the case.
You’re not wrong. Still, if somebody could’ve been bothered to voice their objection to it I could’ve clarified that I meant that Democrats and Republicans are both right-wing only in the same sense that two and 6 million are both positive numbers, not that I was trying to make some bad-faith “both sides” argument. But I didn’t even get one chance to explain myself – no warning, no comment removal without ban, nothing – and that’s not okay.
Banning is a thing that should only happen after a user demonstrates a pattern of bad-faith; not based on a single questionable comment (let alone one that’s only questionable because the mod misunderstood it).
Noone’s going to start pattern-analysing for a 24 hour ban. Your bar didn’t trespass you, they cut you off and told you to go home because your behaviour wasn’t vibing right.
Your offence? Failure to read the room and make the argument in the way you did here. Mods rightly aren’t concerned about individual justice in those cases but keeping the community from beating each other up because they’re shouting past each other.
You sound like a tankie. I’d imagine the mods probably are pretty gun happy when they see some potential tankie show up.
just gonna mention that tankies are allowed in this community so long as they behave
That’s fine by me.
Two faces of the same medal
Not everyone believes the same thing about complex events. Lemmy’s userbase is probably dominated by western white men in tech, judging by the general sentiment on certain issues. Information that is posted ought to be true but we’re not obliged to take sides and automatically accept the western narrative on the Ukraine conflict.
