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The US University experience
Excuse me. They have a women. This is clearly a DEI group of fascist.
Hey ya know, just how it be sometimes
Estonian here, first Yank* scientist on Lemmy to come work at University of Tartu gets a beer on me. Note that when I say “come work at” I mean I live in the city, not that I work at the university too. I dropped out after a semester and a half lol
* Yank refers to the entire USA here, though younger generations don’t use it much. You could be from Texas or California and still be a Yankee.
Same in Finland: a Californian or a Hawaiian is a Yankee (in Finnish: jenkki) here.
I love Tartu, but last I heard, the pay and funding sucked. How is it now?
Apparently it’s only good if you get good grants and scheme around with the money.
According to this professors and above make pretty good money for Tartu cost of living, assuming you’re not trying to support an entire family on a single salary.
Really, it’s a place you could move to for the vibes, but it won’t be the best place to make money.
This is amazing for us in Europe, bring all the educated ones and leave the Trumpers there
Fully onboard with this, welcome to Spain amigo.
well to some of us americans, who can’t leave, this is horrible… but logical….
the last thing i want is all the reasonable people to leave, and be stuck with these fuxks….i kinda wonder now, how much did people fleeing nazi germany contributed to them solidifying power?
It’s kinda funny, this is what Texas did to Oklahoma in regards to our teachers. Put up billboards saying that they paid more in Texas. It’s depressing but it worked lol.
oklahoma wasn’t great before that, but at least it was OK…
Take this up vote and GO
I mean I imagine most people leaving would still keep American citizenship and therefore still be able to vote. Unless they decide to end their citizenship which some might but I imagine most people would still want to keep that option open.
It’s worth noting, keeping your citizenship means paying US federal income taxes, regardless of where you live and work.
Most places have double tax agreements with the US. They’ll be reporting their income to the US, but only paying tax to the US on money earned in the US, from shares for example
The world is looking to China too, their sciences are blossoming. Exciting times ahead while Americans decide who they are and want to be and eventually go through their own Enlightenment. Things are bad now, but tyrants always fall eventually. I think we are entering a sort of golden age for science.
Pity they leave the nukes there, for a bunch of rabid capitalist morons
except they need the same experts to maintain nukes, Nukes have a “expiration date”, they want it to mostly become like russia, where all the money goes to oligarches.
My daughter is about 2 years from graduating high school, and even before Trump came into office I was urging her to consider non-US colleges. Mostly because she wants to go into medicine and our healthcare system has been broken for much longer than I can remember. But also the rise of Fox News (and others) getting away with stating provable lies as fact, Joe Rogan, et al. showed that there has been an inflection point and the country is being led around by the dumbest of us.
She’s fluent in Spanish, though jumping straight into a medical program would introduce a lot of new specialized words, and might be to much. We’re starting to look into options though.
College introduces a lot of new words in general. It is what it’s for, plus, she will be in pre-med. Go for the Spanish route. She will flourish. :) Spain is so lovely. I hope I can land something there next.
Ugh, Spain is amazing. I dream of that country.
Specially in smaller cities away of the big two.
Working in Rota was absolutely frustrating trying to get anything done
Very true. If she’s up for the challenge I really want her to do that. I’d love more reasons to go to Spain.
Medical English is largely stripped-down Latin, I wonder how similar medical Spanish is
The technical terms are very similar. The only issue would be the colloquial terms.
I mean English is sorta the science lingua franca so I imagine most of the technical words would be lone words if they showed up in a paper first.
*loan words, as they were loaned to the language in question.
I interpreted it as meaning lone words as in only a few here and there.
You’re too generous 😅
We interact with people from numerous Spanish speaking countries as part of an intern program, and the one thing every new group says is how funny each other’s slang sounds to the rest of the group. She might have a rough month or two, but then I think it would be fairly smooth after that.
Healthcare in the US is terrible, but part of that is how much providers can charge. Healthcare providers aren’t able to charge as much in communities where it’s considered a basic human right. If she practices outside the US her earnings will probably not be as high - and thats even considering the insurance healthcare providers need to carry to account for lawsuits.
The biggest problem in the US is how the insurance companies insert themselves between the doctor and patient, and tell you what services you’re allowed to receive without even being in the room for the diagnosis.
Meanwhile the Trump administration has asked Australian academics to justify that their US-funded research lines up with Conservative values
And as far as I’ve seen the numbers it’s working too. Anywhere in Europe that is academic or sciency is seeing record numbers of Americans applying. The brain drain will be real.
It has already been happening for several years now, it’s just accelerated since Trump. Even before his first term there was a “negative brain drain” of educated workers no longer coming into the US because the benefits (paid time off, health care, etc) are so much worse compared to other countries, even when considering the higher pay. America used to rely on a steady stream of incoming highly educated workers.
But now there is a huge amount of well established academics leaving for Canada, EU, or anywhere else that will pay them. I work in a physics department at a large R1 university in a very liberal state, and we are losing 4 (that I know of) high regarded professors just this year alone moving to other countries.
The brain drain is here, and won’t be reversing course even if Trump suddenly disappears. We would have to completely change how we reward work and our failing healthcare system for anything to change.
Makes sense. This is doing decades of damage. Plenty of past groundbreaking research came out of the US. But I get it. I wouldn’t want to move to the US either for very much the same reasons. Lack of affordable healthcare, lack of paid holidays and gun safety would be the main reasons. Lack of food regulation would also be a concern. And now the current regime and the way too large chunk of the population that still seems happy with it means we put even tourist travel plans to the US on hold. Too scary at the moment. Trying to help the best I can from here, but there’s only so much you can do at a distance.
its also very hard to get hired as faculty as colleges because of the limited space, alot of people graduaitng in the us with a undergrad thinks thier career path is a PHD, but its too competitive because tenures arnt leaving until thier dead, plus university can be stingy and hiring cheap temporary instructors,. also getting grad degrees are expensive and not easy too. oh yea i also hear about hte lack of wet lab experience before graduating with your undergrad degree, plus the amount of papers people are doing to get noticed by a university on thier CV. when i was in undergrad i was in a talk where the announcer said the professor attending today has to write dozens of research papers just to get hired. and then theres the complaint about quality of said research paper too.
im curious are they moving to other countries because “insurance, pay, politics”?
It’s already happened in Florida and Idaho at least, Idaho lost a huge amount of medical professionals thanks to RvW and state passed open ended and vague laws. Florida lost just about all their teachers DeSantis is stuffing schools with sycophants with little to no education and no teaching credentials. We’re already losing.
All numbers I’ve seen for record applications were for high level research and university level teaching. Maybe the medical doctors mainly moved states? At least I haven’t seen them making headlines about moving to Europe.
Many are leaving teaching all together, it’s a huge problem that’s going to have far reaching consequences for a lot more than 4 years. While they might not all leave the US, they are no longer teaching or practicing medicine in hostile states, Idaho has been forced to shut down hospitals and medical services.
Here in rural CA we’re also seeing medical access dwindle. A lot of things people don’t realize have changed are very drastic, being older I remember not even needing to think about buying produce and inspection it for bugs or rotting. Now, you have to check, and if you aren’t washing everything before you put it away from the store you are getting bugs. It’s gonna happen reliably, many services and newly built things seem shotty and badly done. We have been running out of competency for some time now, and if you’ve been alive long enough were clearly in decline.
Sadly a lot if not most of these changes will take generations to reverse. It’s the sad reality of things.
The main good thing I am taking from the news currently is that as far as I can tell the people won’t accept this for very long. Can’t quite yet tell how or what will happen, but I’d be surprised if the current regime are still in power in the same way 1-2 years from now. The protest are amping up at an intense speed, the videos coming out of the few republicans still giving town halls feel like the crowd is a pot about to boil over.
Yeah, hopefully, but Americans are really bad at fighting back, and easily swayed with very dubious conceits.
I don’t know. It takes a while to get organized but I have confidence that they’ll get there. At least based on what I’m seeing at the moment. Could obviously still just slowly die down again. Time will tell.
This feels sad on the surface, as an American who went to college 25 years ago and is used to seeing people from around the world move here to learn, teach, start businesses, etc.
But giving it any real thought, damn it, it is much better for humanity this way. Climate change isn’t going to pause while the world watches us collapse.
our 4-year university, actually state is actually suffering from low-enrollment issues, its getting so serious as of recently they have slash faculty and “less important classes”: and the faculties getting canned said it was “birth rates”, i was commenting on the sub, said it was HCOL, and low job prospects.
many state Uni in our area also have big problems too. its likely stemmed from covid, where everyone had a shitty education from classes being online only, cant really learn anything if you cant ask in person questions. although i think covid just unmasked systemic issues going before the pandemic. ive seen disasstisfied reviews on yelp going back 2016. i was curious after graduation if any universities had yelp reviews they all did.
It low-key reads like one of those “lonely singles in your area” ads.
Yeah, I good with the message, but that’s one of the most uncomfortable looking photos I’ve seen. Where are they supposed to be looking?
Emotional, fucking, damage.
Why would Americans feel emotional damage from this? They have freedom to be Christian, and self reliant, and proud.
Actual free market at work, as opposed to the shit we have in the U.S.
Yeah brain drain isn’t as cool when it happens here, is it?
Come to Australia! If you’re on the west coast of America, it’s not even that ridiculous a journey. It’s quite like America in lots of good ways, and less so in the insane, gun-toting ways. (Lots of idiot-trucks still, though 😞)
You guys are gutting funding, unfortunately.
this is just latest problem and is only a symptom of a larger set of issues going back to your 1st degree.
they only want scientists(phds) in many countries outside of us(i know there are alot there are struggling after just thier initial undergrad and even thier masters)(struggling as in the job prospects for biotech is quite a bit poor for those who are not eligible for grad school, or need experience)
We have quite a shortage of doctors and other medical professionals in Slovenija. Come on over, guys!
ETA: and professors to teach at the medical university.
Most countries welcome medical professionals with open arms. They are always shortlisted. ;)
PS: I love Slovenija, it is so pretty. I reccomend it too!
theres a shortages in the us to for prof, because the tenures are not retiring to leave any positions open, so alot of them end up not applying to colleges anymore, also the fact that many schools are abusing just using adjuncts only
How much is med school there and are older people welcomed into the schools? I had to drop my premed program here in the US because I either need to be a med student for rural America … which can get fucked imo or pay a million to stay in “progressive” cities.
Oof, I don’t know about that. It’s very difficult even for regular students from other EU countries to get in. There are so few spots opened that they are very strict with the criteria plus domestic students are preferred.
i heard its pretty hard because us has standards that are usually above that of most countries, and some countries thier medical programs might not be equal. Also even if you are MD outside of the usa, its very hard to become one in the USA if you try to immigrate here.
aside from UK, and some other european MED schools , theres much more you have to do to apply to become a med student/MD in the usa. you all heard about people trying to go to caribbean med schools only to be met with more requirements in the USA.
Wouldn’t that be wonderful, so see the greatest brain-drain in human history. Couldn’t happen to nicer people.
I have a friend here in the US who is on a visa and is planning on leaving the US after undergrad and doing grad school in Europe somewhere
